Question about Barbed Arrows


Rules Questions


How is the barbed arrow supposed to work when the bow doesn't have reach?

Spoiler:
Ranged Tactics Toolbox wrote:
Barbed Arrow: *snip* When a barbed arrow is attached to a length of silk rope and fired from a bow, the arrow’s range increment is reduced to 30 feet, but it gains the grapple special weapon quality *snip*
Ultimate Equipment wrote:
Grapple: On a successful critical hit with a weapon of this type, you can attempt a combat maneuver check to grapple your opponent as a free action. *snip* While you grapple the creature using a grappling weapon, you can only move or damage the creature on your turn. You are still considered grappled, though you do not have to be adjacent to the creature to continue the grapple. If you move far enough away that the creature you’re grappling is no longer within the weapon’s reach, you end the grapple with that action.


While it isn't specified, the answer seems to be fairly clear: the "reach" is the length of your rope. If you move farther away, you must drop the rope which ends the grapple.

On a side note, this whole idea seems to be strange. For example, how is it possible to shoot a guy with a barbed arrow tied to a rope, and now suddenly he cannot swing a 2H weapon, he cannot fire a bow back at you, and he cannot even move forward to attack you? None of that makes much sense.

Furthermore, what if your end of the rope is tied to a tree. You still shoot him, he's still stuck to the barbed arrow and still grappled, but for some reason you're grappled too, and now you cannot shoot him with more arrows.

Weird concept, poor rule execution.


Thanks, I'm glad it's not just me thinking this was weird


It is supposed to work like Batman's grappling gun. You fire it at something, and use it to swing or climb.

/cevah

Lantern Lodge

Cevah wrote:

It is supposed to work like Batman's grappling gun. You fire it at something, and use it to swing or climb.

/cevah

The grapple weapon special quality does not operate like a grappling hook.

Grapple Weapon Quality, per PFSRD wrote:
Grapple: On a successful critical hit with a weapon of this type, you can grapple the target of the attack. The wielder can then attempt a combat maneuver check to grapple his opponent as a free action. This grapple attempt does not provoke an attack of opportunity from the creature you are attempting to grapple if that creature is not threatening you. While you grapple the target with a grappling weapon, you can only move or damage the creature on your turn. You are still considered grappled, though you do not have to be adjacent to the creature to continue the grapple. If you move far enough away to be out of the weapon’s reach, you end the grapple with that action. Source: Ultimate Combat.


The way I figure, it doesn't so much as create a grapple situation as it does attach the rope to the target upon a successful grapple check.
The grapple check is to simulate your ability to place the arrow in a location on the target that effectively lodges it in the target's body or armor.
If the rope is attached to a solid object, the target would need to make a grapple check to remove the barbed arrow. If the rope is held by another creature, they would make opposed grapple checks to see if the target can move away, there by dragging the creature holding the rope with it unless the creature holding the rope drops the rope.
The target can still move otherwise, but is tethered in place, with the length of the rope as the limit of it's movement away from the anchor point, until otherwise released from that anchor, either by removing the barbed arrow, or cutting the rope.

Yeah, this could have been much better executed in it's explanation.

The way I plan on using it is to pull targets closer to me if they're flying or hanging from the ceiling or something.


I'm more bothered by the fact that it only activates on a crit. That means you can have a whole quiver (or several) full of barbed arrows tied to individual ropes, and despite hitting with every one of them (and your target trailing dozens of ropes), you get no grapple check. Near as worthless, IMO.


Tvarog wrote:
I'm more bothered by the fact that it only activates on a crit. That means you can have a whole quiver (or several) full of barbed arrows tied to individual ropes, and despite hitting with every one of them (and your target trailing dozens of ropes), you get no grapple check. Near as worthless, IMO.

You can be injured by a glancing blow. There would be no embedding in that case. Furthermore, it needs to embed well enough that pulling on the line won't pull out the arrow. That's what the critical hit represents; hitting them in such a way that the arrow lodges well enough to count them as being grappled.


thread necro - but doing so to express my disappointment with the crit only thing with this as well.

I am building a semi aquatic hunter, and thought these would make the perfect combination with a silk rope and an underwater crossbow - turns out he'll still be a horrible spear fisher, since only a small fraction of his hits will even get a chance to pull the prey back. Combine that with it requiring a grapple check (on a character that is simply not a grappling type - dex for shooting and such) and it's pretty lame.

It really seems like these were just created lazily. They thought - hey, we should make a barbed bolt that can be used to reel someone/something in. Someone else said 'Hey, we already have this grapple weapon property, so just stick that on it!' No one alone the way actually thought about how they would be used in practice.

Scarab Sages

Why not use the Harpoon?


Murdock Mudeater wrote:
Why not use the Harpoon?

The harpoon is decidedly worse than the barbed arrow/bolt. It still depends on the grappling property, which only has a CHANCE of grappling on a critical hit - and it takes exotic proficiency, vs a crossbow with barbed bolts only needing simple.

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