Note: If you have a piece of personal equipment you want to upgrade rather than replace, regard the gift as cash.
"...the hand of God will smack you back into yesterday. "
-Godsmack lyrics
Paladin appropriate?
And it would be totally wrong to ask if that was Wood she felt behind her!
Paladin, Paladin... pure thoughts!
Quick note; Rova will be delayed in posting until he 'buys' his equipment. This exercise, however, is being delayed due to work issues.
Full Disclosure to the new folks (old ones already knew): Rova is played by my husband.
What's happening: He's working at out local casino as a slot tech. His shift is 5:45 AM to 1:45 PM Sat-Wed, off Thurs/Fri. Today, around noon, he called to say he'd just been informed that the entire section was working 2 extra hours today, tomorrow and Wednesday rearranging the machines in one section. needless to say, not only is he exhausted, he's just lost most of his evening time. AND...they get to do the same thing, same days NEXT week as well!
Please bear with us, and chat amongst yourselves if you wish.
I'm here! Take care of business!
hello everyone. I apologize but many things have come up. Both with myself, and externally. I need to take more time to be the man I have to be now so I will have to cut down on my RPG time. As such I will be forced to withdraw from most of my games. Again I apologize for this greatly.
I'm still doing exams.....
Ok, adding the following items to bring my value up..
3260 Comp longbow, large darkwood +1 Adaptive [+6 2d6+5p x3 110'] 3#
44 Arrows, 20 normal, 20 cold iron, 20 silver
500 Ioun stone, cracked dusty rose prism [+1c Initiative]
4000 Sash of the War Champion [+4 fighter levels for Bravery & Armor training]
That'll bring my gear up to 16,657, which includes my starting cash & trait.
Le'me know if'fn an'thin' ain't right.
Are goblins good at flying, too?
If he falls, at least someone will be down there to grab her loot!
Eh... nowhere near as good a jumper as a Monk with High Jump.
Who's up now?
Let's put this puppy, down!
Are you meaning the game or the monster?
Ok, first comment on Unchained:
All Unchained classes are on the table. If you want to, you may switch your current class to the Unchained version.
One major note: the Unchained Monk gets it's good Will Save back. Yes, that means UnC Monk has ALL good saves. I have no issues with that Monk/UnC Monk are both MAD enough that there shouldn't be any problems.
Any further effects will be posted later tomight, though I will most likely not use the new action system.
I'm probably going with background skills and some minor consolidation of other skills (Athletics, Influence).
Are you meaning the game or the monster?
The devil thingy!
...
One major note: the Unchained Monk gets it's good Will Save back. Yes, that means UnC Monk has ALL good saves. I have no issues with that Monk/UnC Monk are both MAD enough that there shouldn't be any problems.
....
What are you talking about, the normal Monk has good saves in every saving throw, the Brawler is the monk/fighter without the good will save.
In Unchained, the monk rewrite had it's good will save removed, supposedly because they gave it a d10 hit die and full BaB.
Also, while I'm not impressed with Variant Multiclassing, you may use it if you wish.
I need to overlook it to know if I would like to use it.
If you need any specific information, let me know and I'll PM you with it.
Didn't realize it was my go... Sorry!
The new skill systems are actually rather easy to explain here, though I'll make each system a separate post; then a final post giving my opinion of them.
First: the Background Skills Variant:
This variant separates the skills into two groups; Adventuring Skills and Background Skills. Adventuring Skills are those useful while actively adventuring, those related to training and practice, each having a clear and specific application to actual adventuring, those used in the majority of skill checks. Background Skills are those skills less directly useful in an adventure. Background Skills include two new skills (which I will be using regardless); Artistry and Lore.
Artistry is used to develop a creative work that isn’t necessarily an object or a discrete performance. For example: Artistry: poetry or Artistry: songwriting replaces the Craft version of those skills.
Lore is a extremely specific subset of Knowledge; for example Lore: elven history as opposed to Knowledge: history, and the character would not need to take Knowledge: history to take Lore: (specific) history or Lore: artistic masterpieces without needing ranks in Appraise, Artistry, or Craft.
While you can spend your regular skill ranks on ANY skill, you get 2 additional ranks you may ONLY spend on Background Skills.
Acrobatics
Bluff
Climb
Diplomacy
Disable Device
Disguise
Escape Artist
Fly
Heal
Intimidate
Knowledge (arcana)
Knowledge (dungeoneering)
Knowledge (local)
Knowledge (nature)
Knowledge (planes)
Knowledge (religion)
Perception
Ride
Sense Motive
Spellcraft
Stealth
Survival
Swim
Use Magic Device
Appraise
Artistry
Craft
Handle Animal
Knowledge (engineering)
Knowledge (geography)
Knowledge (history)
Knowledge (nobility)
Linguistics
Lore
Perform
Profession
Sleight of Hand
The Consolidated Skills Variant:
This variant uses a smaller list, making characters more broadly talented by grouping together related, commonly chosen skills, reducing the number of skills from 35 to 12, and making each skill rank matter more. In many cases, the new skills have been renamed to highlight the nature of the consolidated skills. Even after reducing the number of skill ranks granted, characters will be somewhat more skilled. Character classes that are highly skilled, such as the bard or rogue, get the biggest boost.
Needless to say, this has the biggest effect on the game system, affecting traits, feats, class skills, and race traits.
The Consolidated Skills are
Acrobatics (untrained; Dex*; includes Acrobatics (except jumping), Escape Artist, Fly, Ride)
Athletics (untrained; Str*; Acrobatics (jumping), Climb, Swim)
Finesse (trained; Dex*; Disable Device, Sleight of Hand)
Influence (untrained; Cha; Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate)
Nature (trained; Int; Handle Animal, Knowledge[s]: dungeoneering, geography, & nature)
Perception (untrained; Wis; Perception, Sense Motive)
Performance (untrained; Cha; Disguise, Perform)
Religion (trained; Int; Knowledge[s]: planes & religion)
Society (trained; Int; Knowledge[s]: history, local, & nobility, Linguistics)
Spellcraft (trained; Int; Knowledge: arcana, Spellcraft, Use Magic Device)
Stealth (untrained; Dex*; Stealth)
Survival (untrained; Wis; Heal, Survival)
[*Armor check penalty applies]
Consolidated skills function the same way as the skills they replace, and provide the same +3 bonus. However, the class skill lists change, with the following entries replacing the normal class skills lists. The number in parentheses indicates the number of skill ranks a character of this class gains at each level. Always add 1/2 the character’s Intelligence modifier to this number, even if the modifier is negative. A character always gains a minimum of 1 skill rank per level.
This system cannot be used with Background Skills.
Alchemist (2 + 1/2 Int): Finesse, Spellcraft, Survival.
Arcanist (1 + 1/2 Int): Religion, Society, Spellcraft.
Barbarian (1 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Nature.
Bard (3 + 1/2 Int): Influence, Perception, Performance, Society, Spellcraft.
Bloodrager (2 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Spellcraft.
Brawler (2 + 1/2 Int): Acrobatics, Athletics, Perception.
Cavalier (2 + 1/2 Int): Acrobatics, Athletics, Nature.
Cleric (1 + 1/2 Int): Religion, Spellcraft, Survival.
Druid (2 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Nature, Survival.
Fighter (1 + 1/2 Int): Acrobatics, Athletics.
Gunslinger (2 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Survival.
Hunter (3 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Nature, Perception, Stealth.
Inquisitor (3 + 1/2 Int): Influence, Perception, Spellcraft, Stealth, Survival.
Investigator (3 + 1/2 Int): Acrobatics, Finesse, Influence, Perception, Society, Spellcraft.
Magus (1 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Spellcraft.
Monk (2 + 1/2 Int): Acrobatics, Athletics, Perception.
Oracle (2 + 1/2 Int): Religion.
Paladin (1 + 1/2 Int): Religion, Survival.
Ranger (3 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Nature, Perception, Stealth, Survival.
Rogue (4 + 1/2 Int): Acrobatics, Finesse, Inf luence, Perception, Society, Stealth.
Shaman (2 + 1/2 Int): Nature, Religion, Survival.
Skald (2 + 1/2 Int): Influence, Performance, Society, Spellcraft.
Slayer (3 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Influence, Stealth, Survival.
Sorcerer (1 + 1/2 Int): Influence, Spellcraft.
Summoner (1 + 1/2 Int): Religion, Spellcraft.
Swashbuckler (2 + 1/2 Int): Acrobatics, Athletics, Influence, Perception.
Warpriest (1 + 1/2 Int): Athletics, Religion, Survival.
Witch (1 + 1/2 Int): Nature, Religion, Spellcraft.
Wizard (1 + 1/2 Int): Religion, Society, Spellcraft.
The Grouped Skills Variant:
Using this system, characters gain bonuses for large categories of skills and higher bonuses for specific skills. Instead of replacing or modifying the skill list, this system divides similar skills into groups. Instead of choosing skills and expending skill ranks to gain one skill at a time, characters gain training in a small number of skill groups, and gain specialties that give bonuses to particular skills each level. The groups represent broad talents, and the skill specialties draw from the standard skill list.
With this system, players don’t expend skill ranks. Instead, a character adds ½ their current level when attempting skill checks for chosen grouped skills, thereby making that character at least somewhat competent in skills that might otherwise be neglected. This system makes characters more broadly skilled, but gives them fewer skills they truly excel at.
Grouped skills function like this:
At 1st level, characters gain training in a number of skill groups determined by their class’s number of skill ranks per level. (There's a table) A character can gain training in any skill group, regardless of class skills.
At 1st level, each character gains one skill specialty, plus a number of bonus skill specialties equal to 1/2 their Intelligence modifier. At 2nd level and every 2 levels thereafter, each character gains a specialty in one additional skill. If at any point their Intelligence modifier increases or decreases, their number of bonus skill specialties changes accordingly. Each skill specialty applies to a single, specific skill, and a character is allowed to take a specialty in a skill that isn’t in one of their skill groups. However, their bonus with that skill isn’t as high as it would be if they were also trained in the corresponding skill group.
When determining whether a character can use a trained-only skill, the character must have either a specialty in that skill or training in the skill’s group.
A character can also use Background Skills with this variant; Instead of gaining background skill ranks at every level, a character gains one additional skill specialty at 1st level that can be used only to select a background skill. In that case, the Artistry and Lore skills fall under the Scholarly skill group and the character can take specialties in background skills with their normal specialties, as well. A character can take a specialty in Lore any number of times, choosing a different type of Lore each time. To attempt a check with a Lore skill, a character must have a specialty in it. Having training in the Scholarly skill group doesn’t allow a character to use all the potential Lore skills untrained, but it does enable a character with one or more Lore skills to add their full level as a bonus on those checks, rather than just the normal 1/2 level. If the skill the character is proficient in or specializing in is a class skill, the do still get the +3 for that.
Skill Groups:
Natural [Handle Animal, Heal, Survival]
Perceptive [Perception, Sense Motive]
Physical [Acrobatics, Climb, Escape Artist, Fly, Ride, Swim]
Scholarly [Appraise, Craft, Knowledge (all), Profession, Spellcraft]
Social [Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Linguistics, Perform]
Thieving [Disable Device, Disguise, Sleight of Hand, Stealth, Use Magic Device]
This variant can also be used with consolidated Skills, in which case the groups are as follows:
Consolidated Skill Groups:
Natural [Nature, Survival]
Perceptive [Perception]
Physical [Acrobatics, Athletics]
Scholarly [Religion, Society, Spellcraft]
Social [Influence, Performance]
Thieving [Finesse, Stealth]
When using Consolidated Skills with Grouped Skills, reduce both the number of skill groups and the number of skill specialties characters gain by 1/2 (rounded down, to a minimum of 1) using 1/2 the class’s skill ranks per level from the core rules to determine that class’s number of skill groups and specialties, not 1/2 the adjusted values presented in the Consolidated Skills Variant Class Skills section.
Level =#Specialties (1) =2 + Int (2) =4 + Int (3) = 6 + Int (4) =8 + Int (5)
1st =1 =2 =2 =3 =3
2nd =2 =2 =2 =3 =3
3rd =2 =2 =2 =3 =3
4th =3 =2 =2 =3 =3
5th =3 =2 =2 =3 =3
6th =4 =2 =2 =3 =3
7th =4 =2 =2 =3 =3
8th =5 =2 =3 =3 =4
9th =5 =2 =3 =3 =4
10th =6 =3 =3 =4 =4
11th =6 =3 =3 =4 =4
12th =7 =3 =3 =4 =4
13th =7 =3 =3 =4 =4
14th =8 =3 =3 =4 =4
15th =8 =3 =3 =4 =4
16th =9 =3 =3 =4 =4
17th =9 =3 =3 =4 =4
18th =10 =3 =4 =4 =5
19th =10 =3 =4 =4 =5
20th =11 =3 =4 =4 =5
1 A character adds 1/2 her Intelligence bonus to her number of specialties; characters always have a minimum of 1 specialty.
2 This category includes the arcanist, cleric, fighter, magus, paladin, sorcerer, summoner, warpriest, witch, and wizard.
3 This category includes the alchemist, barbarian, bloodrager, brawler, druid, gunslinger, monk, oracle, shaman, skald, and swashbuckler.
4 This category includes the bard, cavalier, hunter, inquisitor, investigator, ranger, and slayer.
5 This category includes the rogue
I like Background Skills, and will be using them going forward as a houserule.
I do not like the Consolidated Skills Variant, if only for all the extra work needed to update.
I do like a few of the Consolidated Skills, and am considering using them. The ones I'd definitely use are Athletics and Influence. If I was going to used Consolidated Skills, I'd add a 13th; Occupation, containing Artistry, Craft, & Profession and possibly move Perform to it as well.
I'm also considering renaming Sense Motive as Insight and expanding it to make it the social and deductive version of Perception and renaming Sleight of Hand as Finesse.
I like the idea behind Grouped Skills, and the broader base it gives characters without eliminating personal choice in what skills you take. In fact, given that all skills progress automatically, I think it might even allow for more varied skill progression, as it eliminates the need to maintain specific skills, such as perception.
Quick notes on Variant Multiclassing:
With this system, each character can choose a secondary class at 1st level and trains in it throughout their career, without giving up levels in their primary class. Once selected, this choice is permanent (though if using the retraining rules from Ultimate Campaign, the secondary class can be retrained by paying half the cost of retraining all her class levels). A character who selects this option doesn’t gain feats at 3rd, 7th, 11th, 15th, and 19th levels, but instead gains class features from the chosen secondary class. It is probably a good idea to use either this variant system or normal multiclassing, but it’s possible for the two systems to be used together. In a game using both systems, a character can’t take levels in their chosen secondary class.
The character has no choice in which feature to take at each level, and must also abide by any restrictions from that secondary class; i.e. Monk & Druid armor/weapon restrictions, paladin's code, and class alignments.
Spellcasting is never a feature gained in this manner.
Also, there are no VMC options for the Hybrid classes.
Please ask me about a specific class option rather than all of them.
This is a FWIW; What I'm considering as houserules based on Unchained:
Ninja's Unchained Houserules; first try:
Classes:
Barbarian, Rogue, Summoner as Unchained
Adapt Unchained Barbarian Rage for all Rage classes
Unchained Monk; houserule: gets all good saves, including Will
Variant Skill System:
Consolidated Skills Used:
Acrobatics (Dex) - Acrobatics (except for jumping), Escape Artist, Fly, Ride.
Athletics (Str) - Acrobatics (when jumping), Climb, and Swim.
Influence (Cha) - Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate.
New Skills used:
Artistry
Lore
Renamed Skills:
Finesse (Sleight of Hand)
Insight (Sense Motive)
Background Skills:
Appraise
Artistry
Craft
Handle Animal
Knowledge (Engineering, Geography, History, Nobility)
Linguistics
Lore
Perform
Profession
Sleight of Hand
Skill Groups:
Finesseable [rather than Thievery] (Disable Device, Disguise, Finesse, Stealth, Use Magic Device)
Natural (Handle Animal, Heal, Survival)
Occupation (Artistry*, Craft, Perform, Profession)
Perceptive (Insight*, Perception)
Physical (Acrobatics, Athletics*)
Scholar (Appraise, Knowledge [all], Lore*, Spellcraft)
Social (Influence*, Linguistics, Perform)
Other Skill Options:
Expanded Craft
Expanded Profession
Skill Unlocks: Rogue (free); others need Signature Skill feat
Stamina: Fighters (free); others need Combat Stamina feat; Brawlers, Monks can use it for all combat feats; all others only for Fighter Bonus feats
Variant Multi-classing: acceptable for all; characters may instead use standard multi-classing or gestalt (not sure at this point if I want to allow a combination of VMC and standard multi-classing)
Yes, I changed the groups a bit to fit my ideas of linked skills a little better.
Should we dub the game inactive?
Wishing everyone the best and a great summer!
Yes happy 4 of July DM, Thanks for your service!!
I think we say it is inactive.
I...think you may be right. I'm sorry.
I've been having issues running any games except my RL Runelords, and I'm not sure why. I still enjoy gaming, I check every day...but I just, somehow, can't post.
IF everyone who's still here wants to continue, I'll try...but I've said that before and failed.
One other option might be to appeal for a new GM.
Your call folks.
I'm fine waiting for some future time if and when you're ready.
Totally understand.
Wouldn't be interested in a new DM. Others that have more invested might feel differently.