Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
This would be a pretty gnarly encounter for a normal-sized and less heroic party.
Kobold Catgirl |
In the original encounter, the two goblins were just another troglodyte. But yeah, it's still an EL 5 encounter. Pretty painful for a party that should be around second level, which is why the PCs are given the advantage of surprise.
That being said, you guys made a big difference by taking Filge down before he could order the horde to descend upon Farrukh and Robin (and by having a cleric capable of turning undead).
By the way, the bugbear zombie showing no pain was purely flavor text. The attack did normal damage.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
That's okay, Tanith will just have to ham harder to make up for you. =)
Carina Viera |
Okay, so bombs aren't exactly useful here.
Are there any chairs around the room that I can use?
Carina Viera |
Perhaps I should go and get myself a crossbow once all this is done. I'll be needing some money for this, though...
Gark the Goblin |
Hell, I just got mine so Robin wouldn't be the only one with a projectile weapon. You're welcome to it. (It wouldn't be a bad idea for one of the martial types to pick up his old bow, either.)
I'm sort of contemplating (Astraden will sort of be contemplating) taking a rank in Craft (carpentry) and gradually fixing up the old Land farmstead. It'd be nice not to have to pay for lodging every day, and Astraden reallyyy doesn't want to be in town any more than she needs to.
Carina Viera |
Well, Carina has no training with bows.
She does have proficiency with crossbows, however.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Tanith can handle some interrogating if you're going to be up for a bit longer.
Gark the Goblin |
Body count for my benefit
Front chamber: 1 fresh skeleton, 3 rotting ones
Dining room: Nine corpses in various stages of decomposition
Second floor: Severed head, suited mummy thing
Third floor: Owlbear, two burnt goblin skeletons, one goblinoid undead, two troglodyte zombies, one severely rotted human skeleton
Outside: Owl :c
My guess is that the 3 rotting ones in the first chamber and the one rotting one on the third floor are the ones we want. We found Alastor's body in the cairn (also, he may have been lying about dying there? since his headstone was already set up at the Lands' place), so unless we're majorly f#$#ing up we should have all of them.
e: Yep, ninjaed in the game thread.
Kobold Catgirl |
I will point out that no matter how high you roll on Intimidate, these are the limitations:
If successful, the target gives you the information you desire, takes actions that do not endanger it, or otherwise offers limited assistance.
If Filge believes that you are going to kill him no matter what, your only potential leverage over him is a quick death versus a slow one.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Poor intimidate, everybody hates you.
Intimidate kind of loses its magic when you have bargain with the hostages.
Kobold Catgirl |
Sorry. Kinda how interrogation works. ;P
"I'm gonna kill you, blow up your home, and set fire to your goat. So, hey, mind testifying against this crime boss? You'll get a kickass headstone."
If Tanith just wants to shank this guy, he can feel free (I think I've mentioned before that the law enforcement at Diamond Lake doesn't do much), but he's gonna have to work harder to find answers if he does. A bluff check, at the least. Can't have your cake and kill it, too.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Sure but with your interpretation what's the difference between diplomacy and Intimidation. Intimidation already suffers mechanically I don't understand why folks feel the need to kick it while its down.
Effective intimidation should leave victims thinking they're going to be okay. If you have to barter with your victim it's just a worse form of diplomacy.
Kobold Catgirl |
There are tons of places to use Intimidate—in combat and in social encounters. But it's not a substitute for Bluff. If you're trying to get info out of a guy who knows he's gonna be murdered no matter what, you're going to need a different toolbox.
If you don't like that interpretation, consider it a house rule. And if you'll pardon a bit of pretentiousness...
Do not interfere with an army that is returning home. When you surround an army, leave an outlet free. Do not press a desperate foe too hard. —Sun Tzu
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
It's a fairly common one. I just don't understand why everyone hates the skill so much.
Tanith's ready to kill this guy. As far as he's concerned this is all a bluff.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Consider this.
Diplomacy:
"Look, we don't have any beef with you. We'd be happy to see you walk away from here. Tell us what you know and I'm sure we can work something out."
Intimidate:
"Quit your babbling and tell us what you know and you might walk away from here."
Neither is really promising anything but both are asking for the same information.
This:
"Tell us what you know and I promise you can walk away from here."
Loses it's magic. It's not intimidating and it's a big immersion-breaker.
I'm not suggesting intimidate replace bluff. There's no misdirection or lying going on here.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
I think I understand the disconnect. Tanith is not lying about considering letting the wizard go if the information he gives us is worthwhile - nor am I suggesting intimidate be used in such a way. This whole mine mystery could be a giant red herring for all we know. He's not going to promise Filge safe passage under those circumstances especially when we really have no reason to care about his little story.
From my understanding we really only have one goal/quest that's clear - finish exploring the Whispering Cairn. There's been some hints at something involving the Seekers but that's been nebulous at best.
Kobold Catgirl |
You've made it appear that Tanith's sole intention is to kill Filge. If it's not, that's another matter. But if "considering" is no more than a half-truth, yeah, it's gonna need a Bluff check. I'm gonna need that clarified before we proceed.
That being said, I would require a Bluff check of that Diplomacy attempt, too. If it's a lie, it's a lie. :P
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
But it's not a lie!
Poor Tanith. KC is calling him a liar all night. =(
Kobold Catgirl |
But it's not a lie!
Poor Tanith. KC is calling him a liar all night. =(
And to clarify this message:
That being said, I would require a Bluff check of that Diplomacy attempt, too. If it's a lie, it's a lie. :P
Note the "If" it's a lie.
In other words, Diplomacy has the exact same limitations as Intimidate. If it's a lie, a check is needed. If it's not, a check is not needed.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
I think the confusion is stemming from the belief that Tanith was being dishonest in some way. Tanith's not that kind of wrestler.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Pfft. That's exactly what someone trying to cover up a conspiracy would say.
Dungeon Kobold |
Tanith knows too much already.
Wait, who are we kidding? Tanith doesn't even know enough, forget the idea of excess.
Cuetzpalli |
Wow. That was a long argument discussion. Time to go read the gameplay and figure out what the fuss was about.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
From a story telling angle, I'm not sure how I feel about the ghostly lock-breaker.
Dungeon Kobold |
Everyone, advance to level three. Note any major changes here. Remember, HP is half the hit die +1. Congratulations!
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Level 3 - Wrestler 1
+10 HP (d12 + 3)
2 skill points (diplomacy and intimidate)
Feat: Power Attack
Uncomfortable Strength (Ex):
At 1st level the wrestler gets the Improved Unarmed Strike feat for free. Wrestlers suffer no off hand penalties for unarmed strikes. A wrestler may apply his full Strength bonus on damage rolls made from his unarmed strikes. A wrestler’s unarmed strikes count as both a weapon and a natural weapon for purposes of enchantment through spells. A wrestler’s unarmed strikes also gains bonus damage as per the monk class table. His bonus is a die size higher than the monk’s, but he applies his bonus damage only against a target he is grappling. A character’s wrestler levels stack with monk levels for determining unarmed damage inside of a grapple.
TDLR Version: See Monk Unarmed Strike.
Crushing Grip (Ex):
The wrestler gains the Improved Grapple feat. While choosing to deal damage in a grapple after maintaining a grapple, the wrestler deals damage 1.5x his Strength modifier damage as though he were using a two-handed weapon instead of just his Strength modifier. This also applies to wrestling techniques which use the wrestler’s unarmed damage. A wrestler gains this at 1st level.
Grappling Techniques (Ex): Bulldog
The wrestler may declare he is using this technique after successfully maintaining a grapple as normal. The wrestler grabs ahold of the target’s head and jumps forward (though not far enough to actually
change spaces), dragging his target to the ground. The wrestler deals his unarmed damage, and the target becomes pinned.
Rynjin |
^What is that from? I just built a Wrestle man for a Mythic game so I'm kinda curious as to where you're getting that.
+9 HP (d10+1 FCB+2 Con)
+7 skills (Acrobatics, Disable Device, Kn. Local, Kn. Dungeoneering, Perception, Stealth, Survival).
+1 Feat (Shield Focus)
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
If you're of the optimization school of thought, I'd suggest you steer clear. It's really really bad but I love the flavor.
Little Red Goblin Games wrote it in a book called King of the Ring. Apparently their stuff is down on the paizo store for some reason so I can't link it here.
Rynjin |
Gotcha. I didn't see anything particular I wanted (I have all of that and more from a combination of Tetori/Brawler (Fighter) and Feats like Dragon Style/Ferocity) but it looked interesting as a straight class, and I'm on the lookout for a new class to take after my 9th Tetori level if I don't just continue in either that or Brawler (currently Tetori 8/Brawler 4).
This being a Mythic game my wrestler's first act was to put a Froghemoth into a headlock and then bludgeon it into a wall (Note: My guy has no size increasing magic or anything like that. So it's just this "small" 6' 10" German dude bodyslamming a 30+ ft tall several ton beastie). Liking him so far.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Tetori is solidly in the opposite camp for me. Great mechanics - hate the flavor.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Yeah, I have a hard time divorcing the two.
I wish they hadn't doubled down on the asianess.
Tanith 'Kordson' Creed |
Seeing 'Qinggong' in your header makes me cringe every time. =(